(no subject)

[realexplodingcat]

Now hold still and let me tell you about a band named Turn Pale. Long have I wondered, just what happened to the grand lineage that gave birth to gothic music? Where are the cataclysmic dirges? Where are the epileptic rhythms that challenge your feet and startle your heart? Where are the voices that cry in horror at this oh so bleak world?

I found it.

I found it crawling out of American's heartland. Crawling out of Indiana, of all places...

Turn Pale brings art to your ears in the truest sense of the word. A caterwauling barrage of raw grooves and experimental design with one foot deeply buried in the grave of old school gothic rock. I readily admit that they are not always an easy listen. Most people seem to love them or hate them. Please, do as you please. But understand that if you hate them, that's your own insular opinion. If you hate them, if you hate any art, perhaps it is because you don't understand it, or are not willing to listen and understand. Art is not always here for your entertainment, sometimes (the best of it anyway) is here to challenge you and your perceptions. If you are not up for the challenge, humbly say so and take a step back, because there are many of us that will step up and willingly lend an ear to the questions being asked of us. We may not have answers, but we respect those that have the courage to challenge us. And it is only through continually embracing challenge, that we may grow as individuals. And we should thank those who offer us that opportunity.

Comments

[xiane.livejournal.com]

Thank you. That rocks.

That was an excellent description, as well.

[ex-carnaval-619.livejournal.com]

What can I say to that, other than "Here! Here!". I *heart* Turn Pale and must and have expose/d them to all people I know since the last Turn Pale & The Brides show. Wow.

[jdavyd.livejournal.com]

But understand that if you hate them, that's your own insular opinion.

sorry, i cant agree with that.

[explodingcat.livejournal.com]

That's cool. Although, I'm just saying it's unfair to always expect that everyone will agree with you. However, there's nothing wrong with a group of individuals sharing an opinion.

[jdavyd.livejournal.com]

understand as well that i wasnt refering to the band, but the statement. ive never heard the band so i cant judge them.

[explodingcat.livejournal.com]

Good to know you don't form opinions before hearing something. Although I'm still not entirely sure what it is about the statement you disagree with. Out of context, the statement may have varying interpretations. Of course...my entire post is lacking some of the context that inspired it anyway.

[jdavyd.livejournal.com]

But understand that if you hate them, that's your own insular opinion.

thats almost contradicting itself... i dunno. mebbe its just me.

[explodingcat.livejournal.com]

Oh well...perhaps this is a case of the English language failing. Every now and then words just don't properly convey what I'm trying to say.

[jdavyd.livejournal.com]

ok, im a bit more awake now, so let me see if i can articulate a little bit better.

the general feel of the statement i got was - you felt like people may discount them with no basis for an opinion - put them down for no reason. but in saying what you said, you were doing the same thing - putting them down without basis.

some people out there may have a valid reason for not enjoying their music. but i know what you mean, theres a lot of bands that i feel the same way about!

[krasota.livejournal.com]

Actually, there are people everyday who discount other ideas, people, things, and experiences solely because their friends don't like said idea, person, etc. I have a problem with that--I don't discount *anything* solely on one other person's experience. I don't absolutely adore anything based on another person's predilection, either. I prefer to base my opinions on personal experience and research and in my *experience* people who talk trash about a band they've never heard are POOHEADS. ;)

They may not always be pooheads, but they certainly are pooheads when they act like that.

[jdavyd.livejournal.com]

you know, you never gave me my pictures!

[krasota.livejournal.com]

i think i might've given them to patrick last week.

[explodingcat.livejournal.com]

you felt like people may discount them with no basis for an opinion - put them down for no reason. but in saying what you said, you were doing the same thing - putting them down without basis.

To whom is that third "them" referring to? Who am I putting down? The band? Or the people I'm complaining about?

This analysis of my words is getting deeper than I expected. Not a bad thing.

I assume you are say I'm putting down the people complaining about the band without having any knowledge of their valid reasons. On one level, the statement's intended interpretation was a reminder to people of a fact: we are all individuals. If one individual has an opinion, that individual has a right to own their opinion. They have a right to share their opinion. They have a right to believe their opinion is superior. However, since they have no absolute authority over the minds of other individuals, they do not have the right to assume that other individuals should and/or do agree with their opinion. Just a factual statement, the validity of which changes only if said individual is in possession of a perfect mind control device.

On another level, there is a qualitative statement in the subtext of my post for which I won't apologize. I am putting down people who engage in two certain behaviors: 1) Forming an opinion about a band without actually hearing the band. Just acting like a sheep and following the herd, when only one or two vocal members of the herd have listened to the band. That's lazy opinion making. Don't let others make opinions for you. 2) Having such blatant disregard to the fact that not every individual shares the same opinion about a band. You may hate the band, but respect the fact that there are probably several people who like the band.

Concrete example and summary: 1) I like Turn Pale after hearing them (good). 2) Some people don't like Turn Pale after hearing them (good). 3) Some people haven't heard Turn Pale and don't like the band just because someone told them not to like the band (bad). 4) Some people don't like Turn Pale and act like an ass/talk shit/etc ruining the experience of seeing the band for those who do like Turn Pale (bad, especially if they also fall into category 3).

[jdavyd.livejournal.com]

i agree with the last paragraph, completely.

my beef was with the word insular.

websters describes insular as - characteristic of an isolated people; especially : being, having, or reflecting a narrow provincial viewpoint.

it seems rather insular to refer to someones opinion as insular without knowing anything about it.

sorry, didnt mean to come off like an ass =)

[explodingcat.livejournal.com]

I was pretty sure we were on the same wavelength...that this discussion was an issue of semantics.

Honestly, I had my doubts about the word "insular" when I used it, but I left it in during a fit of writing passion. I was going for the other definition: "Of, relating to, or constituting an island." Sort of a very muddy unclear metaphor for each of us being an island and the opinions born on our island live only on our island. Blah blah...you can see this is a rather messy metaphor, especially since the negative connotations of the word far out-weigh my intended usage.

Good call. Poor diction. You're not an ass :)

[jdavyd.livejournal.com]

word up my homie